Controlling Gun Violence

[ppine]

I am troubled by the continuing mass murders we keep hearing about. I have given the issue lots of thought. We can mostly agree that gun control won't help. We do not do a very good job of dealing with mental health issues in this country. Insurance won't cover it, there is a stigma attached etc. The streets are full of homeless people with mental health issues. It seems like the stories about suspects and convicted criminals in shooting always "had a history of mental illness." We have a registry of sex offenders. Where is the violent offender list? I want to know if a violent person moves into my community. They could be prevented from owning guns like felons and have a parole officer.

Currently, it seems like the number of lives we lose to guns each year from these murders, exceeds the lives saved by having people armed and able to protect themselves. The gun culture that Costas eludes to is firmly entrenched in this country and is probably not going away. The most extreme preppers and survivalists seem fixated on semi-auto weapons and stockpiles of thousands of rounds of ammo. Some of them seem to have fantasies about killing people to survive and fighting over a loaf of bread. They see themselves killing for food. These types of people are mostly not dangerous, but they are if they are around some of the violent mental cases mentioned above.

When you hear people talking crazy, say something. You may help save someone's life.

[CozInCowtown]

How many unarmed/disarmed Jews lost theur lives back in the 30s and 40s??

So, making guns illegal will take them off the streets?
We should make meth and heroine illegal also, eh!

Gun free Zones are just target rich enviroments for psychopaths.

I blame this atrocity on those who think buildings full of defenseless children and those who love and care for them is a good idea.
One armed teacher, principle, security guard, janitor, parent.......just somebody, anybody.

This is nothing but fulfillment of the gun control agenda.

My prayers to those who were lost and those who suffered the loss of loved ones.

JMO,
DC

[IndianaHiker]

No I can't see that having an armed parent, teacher, janitor , security guard, is the answer. If someone is going to be armed it needs to be someone that his highly trained, and extremely proficient. Most of the above persons are not. If someone is going to armed in a school it needs to be a law enforcement professional that has special training, and is required to have their skills tested, and to practice these skills on a regular basis.

I can't say that I am pro gun but I am not anti-gun either. I don't carry and I at this point don't even own a firearm. The choice not to carry is my personal choice and I have not problem with anyone that choices differently as long as they are responsible. I elect not to carry as I am not willing to spend the time and resources to get training on a regular basis and to keep my skill level with a weapon to where I feel it needs to be to carry in public. For me to carry I would want to be on the level of a special forces operator. I know that my work schedule, money to spend for ammo and range time will not allow that level of commitment. Therefore I don't carry. That and the fact that the responsibility and liability if ever faced with a situation where I might harm or kill an innocent bystander. I am not willing to take that risk. Would rather be killed going after someone with a gun with my pocket knife than live with that. Another reason I don't carry as I really don't feel the need. I think that most every situation I encounter things are not that dangerous. Being aware of my situation and what is happening around goes a good distance in keeping me safe.

Any just my two cents for what it is worth.

[CozInCowtown]

I wonder what the reaction time for Navy SEALs is??
I am sorry but being I was never a Navy SEAL does not negate my ability or responsibility to protect my child or local children from a psychopath at school, home or anywhere else.
I would allways prefer to have an armed parent, principle, teacher or any other concerned person on location that waiting for the cops to show up and help count the bodies.
A good person will allways do incredible acts in the face of evil.
JMO also,
DC

[Grandpa]

I was sitting in a hospital waiting room when I saw the initial news reports on the TV. I began crying as I heard this. The totally senselessness of it all. The anguished parents, teachers and schoolmates.

How to control gun violence? shoot back. Why are so many of these senseless killings in schools? Because schools are a gun free zone. So are court houses but only a crazy person would try this there. Too many police and security guards. To get a concealed carry permit requires training and proficiency tests. You just can't waltz down, slap some money down and get that permit. Even taking the classes won't give you enough skill to pass the proficiency tests.

Next is the media. They are in the business of selling copy and they do and say whatever they can to get your attention. You all heard about Holmes and the theater shooting in Aurora but did you hear about the church shooting there?
Two Aurora Shootings: One Widely Known; the Other Ignored

aurora church shooting - Yahoo! Video Search

No mainstream media said a word about the church shooting. It goes against their agenda that someone was able to shoot back. The same with the Trolley Square shooting in Salt Lake City. While the police were surrounding that mall, the perp was walking down the hall with a 12 guage and a bag of shells shooting anyone that moved. Until a person with a concealed shot him.

We are going to hear a lot about the evils of guns. But we sure won't hear anything about the need for better control of violent people. Violent people don't bother with concealed permits or background checks. It's too easy for them to get guns from crooked politicians and beaurocrats (Fast and Furious).

[Grandpa]

Shooting back? I suspicioned something like this when I listened to the Police report on the Clackamas Mall shooting this week. I had heard a report that a legal concealed carrier was involved.

Clackamas Mall Shooter Was Confonted By Concealed Carrier (Oregon)

[oldsarge]

[QUOTE=ppine; The most extreme preppers and survivalists seem fixated on semi-auto weapons and stockpiles of thousands of rounds of ammo. Some of them seem to have fantasies about killing people to survive and fighting over a loaf of bread. They see themselves killing for food. These types of people are mostly not dangerous, but they are if they are around some of the violent mental cases mentioned above.

When you hear people talking crazy, say something. You may help save someone's life.[/QUOTE]

Reason: If we to get into a ring and box and you had you hands tied behind you. how would you feel? Mass murders don't use muzzle loaders to commit crimes. Never fight fair, always one up your opponent. That's why criminals and nut have guns. I do agree that there are some really violent groups out there just waiting for the day they can unleash their hatred.

You are 100% correct about identifying those who act in a suspicious manner. I don't think we hear half of what goes on out there about crimes being stopped by people who were alert.

[Lorax]

Let's look back since say....Columbine.

Now let's take the method or "tool' in which the evil was done and take it out of the equation. What are we left with?

All young males aged 18-24. Most all had mental issues. How many had been on medication? How many were currently under some kind of treatment? The answers are very telling but we ignore them. Why do we ignore them?

Because the gun is the symptom of the disease. It's easier to think we could treat the symptom and it will all go away. Ever hear of the Bath School incident? The "tool" doesn't matter. What matters is getting to the root of the problem.

The young men in this country are in serious trouble. I believe years of telling people they are super-special and removing personal accountability from everyone (It's always someone or something else's fault!) leads to people who feel like victims all the time and lash out violently instead of coping with distress and working through problems.

We treat the symptoms because we don't want to admit that WE failed as a society. We get clues and hints through social media, facebook and twitter and see people irrational or way too stressed. We then sit back anonymously at our monitors and say "OOhh! This could get interesting!" instead of getting involved. It's our own little reality TV show in real time and we as Americans have made sport out of it. We don't get involved because we're so afraid of jumping to conclusions or "hurting someone's feelings". It's so much easier to say we didn't see the tweets or we had no clue somebody was about to snap when something bad eventually happens. Then it usually comes out, as it already is in this case,that the signs were there for a long time and we all stood by and did nothing.
The root of the problem is our society today and the most heinous part of itself, our "canary in the coal mine" is the actions of this group of people, the young males in this country that we should be taking care of and figuring out where we've lost our way with them. It's time to get to and focus on the true root of the problem. That answer will show that we as a society have failed and that's a hard pill to swallow.

I'd rather swallow that pill and do something proactive than go through another day like yesterday.

[oldsarge]

[QUOTE=Lorax;78307] Ever hear of the Bath School incident? The "tool" doesn't matter. What matters is getting to the root of the problem.

I recently saw a post here about this. Well said Lorax!


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[Grandpa]

Excellent post Lorax. Very well said.

And putting the tool back into the mix, the number one weapon for violent crime in the U.S. is still the baseball bat.